Anyone considered an FA20/4U-GSE swap?

[milchmann]

Has anyone considered an FA20/4U-GSE swap in the AE86? Totaled FR-S and BRZ's are going for dirt cheap.

http://www.carfrom.us/car/search/action ... ION%20FR-S" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The low center of gravity would be awesome, and the trans looks like it would fit in an unmodified tunnel. Not really interested in doing this my self right now, but curious to hear others thoughts on it.

[Hatemy7]

Bro I would love too!!!

Ive raced against one on the freeway in my buddies 350z and sure enough man that thing kicked my buddies 350z ass lol

[McKenney]

really? your friend's Z is either slow, or the FRS?BRZ was modded. They're not that fast. Thaison's F20c swapped 86 is much faster than the FRS.

[RotaSpinna69]

Don't make the mistake of putting an NA Boxer engine in a Toyota...like Toyota did :/

[Hatemy7]

^ really? why you say that?

Also the z is stock but that frs moved. I honestly wouldnt mind at all after seeing it run.

[milchmann]

To accommodate increasingly strict emissions laws, the FR-S stock exhaust has way to much back pressure and produces terrible high RPM torque (its essentially flat). A high flow cat and decent exhaust puts the FA20 on par with an F20c. What really makes the FR-S quick is the gearing.



If you want to go fast in a strait line, the F20c is a better option no question (600+ hp on stock bottom ends is not unheard of there). All that said, the real appeal of the FA20/4U-GSE is the lower center of gravity, and the possibility of not needing to bash the transmission tunnel.

As far as an FR-S or BRZ being quicker than a 350? Maybe, in a very short burst from a rolling start where it was already at 4k RPM it could pull on a 350 for a split second. I do not know the specs on them, but my old mans stock 370 will hit 65 mph in 1st gear (it feels like it wants to keep going, but the rev limiter kills it), and the torque steer going into into second is so severe that if you do not know what you are doing the car spins. It drops roughly 4.5k RPM perfectly into the low side of the power band. If you do the math there, that is an insanely large drop (tall gears) for a car that does 0-60 in 4.5 seconds (a.k.a. shit tons of torque). As you can see from the torque curves of the stock FR-S, it dies at about 6k RPM, and the gearing only drops 2.5k RPM at red line to stay in the power band (close gearing).

--edit

Oh yeah, the FR-S has a better gear box than the s2k reduction gear insanity as well.

[milchmann]

^ really? why you say that?

Also the z is stock but that frs moved. I honestly wouldnt mind at all after seeing it run.

I really like it

[Hatemy7]

wow that is good info!!!!

but wouldnt it just be an easier swap with the new frs motor?

ive seen the s2k swaps already in ae86 and a lot of fabbing is included into it

[milchmann]

but wouldnt it just be an easier swap with the new frs motor?

FA20/4U-GSE is the FR-S motor. It goes by two different codes. As far as I know, no one has attempted this. It appears it would fit based on loose measurements I took of my FR-S.

I am interested in what other people think about it / maybe provoke someone into doing it. I am personally prepping to do a 4AGE large port build ... mostly to learn more about pushing the most I can out of a motor.

[dr.occa]

Well, it would be a marriage between old and new to some degree.

[RotaSpinna69]

You have to convert to OBD2, returnless/direct injection fuel system, wireless throttle system, transmitter key and ignition assembly, etc, etc, etc....no thanks...

I have a Tundra 5.7 3URFE sitting upstairs in the warehouse and it will DEFINITELY fit in the FRS, but the AE86 barely has enough room for a 1UZ. I doubt the Subaru engine will fit in between the frame rails of the Corolla. VERY doubtful...

Just turbo the 4AGE real cheap and call it a day. Let's be realistic here

[McKenney]

The 1uz fits quite well thank you!

[milchmann]

You have to convert to OBD2, returnless/direct injection fuel system, wireless throttle system, transmitter key and ignition assembly, etc, etc, etc....no thanks...

Had not considered the throttle. Good point.

The pump system could possibly be a concern to. I am not sure how many stages it is. I will have to dig into mine and look. If the pickup fits though, it should not really be an issue either.

The key/ignition is actually pretty simple.
OBD2? Not really sure how that is an issue, F20 swaps contend with the wiring on this as well.

I think I should reiterate that I am not even considering doing this swap, at least right now, I just think it is an interesting concept. I come from a FF road racing background, and I tend to think about things that make cars perform better in that arena.

BTW, the FR-S is only 69.9 inches wide and 101.5 inch wheel base... the AE86 is 64 inches wide with 94.5 inch wheel base. There is about 6 inches of clearance to either side between the wheel wells and the engine on the FR-S. I have not measured, and do not have both cars with me right now, but I believe the FR-S has substantially wider wheel wells.

[joel26]

looks like it would be a lot of work to fit it in there.... but that's just me...

[nt66]

All the obd2/ignition switch/throttle issues go away with a decent standalone. Also the frs/brz key system is quite a bit more complicated than the s2000